Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:00 In today's episode, we unpack the perfect church, visitor followup process and what your church needs to do to implement it. We hope this podcast helps your church reach more people and grow. This is the retried podcast.
Speaker 1 00:00:23 You're listening to the read-write podcast. The show dedicated to helping pastors and church leaders reach people the right way, hosted by me, Thomas Costello. And with me as always is my cohost Ian Hyatt. We're here to help you your church see more visitors and grow.
Speaker 0 00:00:51 Hey guys, welcome to the retreat podcast. Episode number 47. I am your host Thomas Costello. And with me as always is my cohost Ian Hyatt. What's up Thomas. Hey, Ian, looking forward to our conversation here today. We're going to be talking about how to build the perfect church visitor followup process. This is going to be a good, um, a good conversation, bold title. I know that we're going to tell people how to fill the perfect one, but man, um, we've done a few episodes already about assimilation processes and visitor followup. And so we've had these conversations, um, that have given lots of tips on how to improve it, but I still feel like what people, um, what we hear a lot, uh, is in these conversations, people will tell us that their visitor followup process, their assimilation processes, a work in progress, or it's not quite there yet.
Speaker 0 00:01:44 And so I thought it would be helpful today just to give, um, our idea of what the perfect process would look like. One that as someone that's pastored a church before, um, and I've seen this process work and play out really well in our church and churches that we talk to now, all that to say, we know it's bold. I'm sure there are other processes that are not necessarily imperfect if they don't follow this. Uh, but I think that for those of you that maybe have a, um, a thrown together or not fully built out visitor follow-up process, we hope this serves as kind of a template for you that would really work for your church. Yeah,
Speaker 2 00:02:25 That's good. And I think, you know, churches have struggled with this for a while, you know, assimilation and follow up and all of that and, and, uh, for a lot of different reasons, but, uh, one encouragement I've seen over the last year with the pandemic and all of the pandemic kind of forced churches to get a little bit better at this, uh, especially with everyone going digital and, and, uh, and capturing people's information online. So we're going to dig into that a little bit and, um, just good strategy. That's kind of come out of that whole thing too, but, uh, yeah, I think this would be very helpful. And why don't I kick us off here for the, uh, the first one
Speaker 0 00:02:58 First step is pretty simple. You've got to
Speaker 2 00:03:00 First gather their information, right? So you can't do anything if you don't have someone's contact information. And I know we're in this age where people are being spammed more than ever, people are using trash email addresses that they give to vendors and all of that stuff. Cause they just were bidding being hit with all this and people worried about their information out there on the internet in general or on social media and all of that. So we get that, it's kind of, it's a scent. It can be a sensitive thing to people, but, but let's face it if someone's already interested in coming to your church or they come to your church. Well, we can assume that it's okay to, to ask them for this. So, um, so I guess that brings kind of the first question that I know we've heard when we've made this recommendation or if we talked to churches and that's usually kind of like, well, what kind of information should we gather? I know I hear that, that question when I consult with churches is okay, what's acceptable and all of that. So your thoughts and ideas on that. I mean, the first thing we think of is of course name, email emails, kind of an easy ask phone number, maybe. What do you think about that?
Speaker 0 00:04:11 Yeah. So, um, I think to, uh, to kind of back what you were saying before, and before I answer though, what should we gather question? I think that this is something that I find a lot of pastors are scared of, like asking people. And I guess I get it is that you feel like some people will tell you no and nobody likes hearing no. And so I, I understand that, but it's just something that you have to get over that in order to disciple people, you need to know how to get ahold of them. That's just the, and if your mission is to do, when people that Jesus had disciple them to become more like Jesus, you're going to need their contact information to do those kinds of things. So asking for that is something really important. So what should you ask for, uh, there has been a lot of research on this, not just in the church world, but in the business world.
Speaker 0 00:04:57 I know cause we ask people for their information and we have on average about 25 to 30 people giving us their information every single day here at reach. Right. Um, and there is proof that the less information you ask for the more information you will get, uh, so the more number of people that will give it. So if you ask people for, uh, in their, in that contact card or wherever you're having it on your website, wherever it is, uh, at a minimum you'll need to ask for their name, you'll need to ask for their email address. I would recommend their phone number and I would in most cases, uh, ask for their address, but generally only ask for the information that you actually plan to use. Uh, so if you're going to, um, ask for their email, you need to be willing to email them. If you're gonna ask for their phone number, you're going to be texting them at a minimum. If you're going to ask for their address, you're going to be sending them something like a card in the mail or something like that. So what you shouldn't ask for in this first form, uh, is how did you hear about us? What did you like best about your visit with us? Um, you shouldn't be asking for names and information on all their, their family members or kids you shouldn't ask for their birthdays.
Speaker 0 00:06:13 So all that can come later, but getting those probably four pieces name, address, phone number, mailing address, I'm sorry. Uh, email address. Uh, those are the things that you need to ask for there. So yeah, number
Speaker 2 00:06:27 Be optional too. That's kind of an idea. Sometimes people just make that an optional thing. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:06:33 I think really everything on these, if it's a physical card, everything is innately optional, right? Like they don't have to write their name. There's no, you can put it in the offering basket, whether you have your address on there or not, uh, with these digital ones. Yeah. I would encourage you to make everything optional, except for the name. You need to know who you're talking to. Uh, but even email address. Cause people will sometimes kind of alter their communication preferences based on what is optional, what is required. But I really wouldn't ask for more than those four things on the first one, but that brings to the next question is when, when should we gather this information? Do you have any thoughts on that all the
Speaker 2 00:07:09 Time? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I mean, I think that that's just a given nowadays everyone's doing things on their own time and there's so many different outlets and places where it can be gathered. And so I think that you should always be doing it because I mean, that's really, that doesn't mean you don't always have to follow up right. At a certain time. So, but to always be gathering, it is a good thing. Cause it's coming your way and then you can organize a good followup time. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:07:39 I think that the main shift here is a paradigm shift because I think two or three years ago, almost every church did their, they gathered information on Sunday mornings on the physical cards that people would drop into the offering. And I think in, in my view that that seems like you'll get, you will get fewer responses if you just use that method. And I think now, uh, doing it digitally online and giving people opportunities to do that before their visit, I think that has proven to be something that really is the best time to gather someone's information because it kind of confirms their visit. If they, if someone gets on there and they plan their visit and you do like a letter, let us know you're coming form on your website or a pre-register your kid's form on your website. So they'd give you their information before they show up.
Speaker 0 00:08:31 Um, the truth is, is that they're going to, they're going to be more likely to make that first visit. They're going to be more, what we've found is that they're stickier is that people that do that, they're more likely to come back again. And so I think the, the idea behind this question of when should we gather it, I think pulling that forward as much as possible to before the first visit, that only benefits you. Um, so that's always a good thing to do it lets you contact them ahead of time and do those kinds of things. So yeah, but if you're doing things
Speaker 2 00:09:04 Online now, there's you, you covered a few of them like plan your visit. Pre-registered another good one is an online connection card. This is something we see more of just for one more idea. After someone watches a message online, they can fill out a card, just maybe letting you know, even what they're interested in. They may have, they may have a prayer need. They may have, they may want to know about how to get baptized at your church or something like that. So we just have the opportunity. Now, if you have a good web presence to ask people in a lot of different ways. So I remember on, in the old days on old church websites, really, the only thing was like a contact us page and a prayer request form. But now we have so many other ways that people can initiate that and give you their info. So that's good. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:09:50 It says if we're talking about call to action in every single conversation we ever have and it's, this is the chief of station. I I'm sure that we will. Yeah. I'm sure I'm sure that we will. So here's the last question I think we get about gathering information kind of the first step in the perfect visitor followup process is how do we get people to do that? Because what I think a lot of, one of the hiccups that pastors run into is that they'll have these connection cards, they'll have an online connect card or a pre-register art. And you know that they, they get a small percentage of people actually filling it out. Uh, and this is something that we measured, uh, at the last church, I was pastoring. We, we looked really closely at these numbers and we saw about 80% of our in-person visitors would fill out a card.
Speaker 0 00:10:41 Uh, and um, we saw that, well, most visitors didn't pre-register before they showed up again, we, we found those to be very sticky, but I think there's some things you can do to improve the number of people that give you their information, therefore kind of move into your assimilation process. Um, the main thing you have to do though, is you have to give them a reason you have to incentivize it, um, because people are much more guarded with their information than they ever were before. Uh, you know, uh, 30 years ago or 20 years ago when, uh, when we were younger, Ian, um, we would, you would ask someone for their, their information and the odds of them giving you their number. Like that was like the nervous thing that guys would have to ask girls for when we were kids. Right. Did you get her number, right?
Speaker 0 00:11:27 Like you call her as the assumption with that now or beeper number pager, right? Absolutely. If you were really dating ourselves, I'm not that old, but uh, I think that nowadays people are much more guarded with any of that information. Um, so if you don't give them a reason to give it to you, your odds of getting that information are very slim. Now it's, you know, some person might want just to talk more, has a deep need that they need to talk to a pastor about. That's great. Uh, you can reach out to those people, but, um, I think you need to give something away. So for those pre-registration or those let us know you're coming forums, it's usually, uh, you'll promise some kind of a gift when they arrive. You'll tell them that we'll help you get your kids checked in and that will get you a seat in the middle.
Speaker 0 00:12:15 So you don't stick out and kind of get you, give them some kind of a promise for people on Sunday mornings that are filling out a card, or maybe they're doing it online. You need to give them a reason to you. You probably have some kind of swag or, uh, I know at our church we gave $5 coffee gift cards. This is a small price to pay for someone that could be a part of your church long-term and you can make a decision, help them make a decision to follow Jesus. I think it's, it's worth it every single time. If it helps us move people down that assimilation road. So anything to add to that?
Speaker 2 00:12:47 Not much, no, I think he covered it at my church. Does it start to get hot here in the summer? My church does a water bottle. So get creative, you know, and what you can kind of let people like, you know, something that they'll actually they'll actually take advantage of and it doesn't have
Speaker 0 00:13:02 To be expensive. Another thing I'd say too. So a little little tidbit is I think being specific about what they get is better than being, uh, being kind of, uh, uh, hiding it a little bit. So I hear some churches when I listened to an online message, they'll say, you know, we have a, we have a special gift for you or something like that is what they'll say. You know what? Get up there and hold up that water, bounce it, we have this really nice water bottle. We want to give it to you and everybody in your family, we want to give you guys one, or we have a $5 gift card right here. Use a, uh, um, some kind of a, a visual aid to help you with that. And not just kind of the special gift mode there. So cause they could be thinking
Speaker 2 00:13:42 Anything they can. And when we're talking about spirituality, they give you think, oh, they're going to give me my, get out of hell free pass or something like that. So you don't know what they're thinking. So you want to be, I agree,
Speaker 0 00:13:53 Make sure would be of the gospel of John or something like that is what they probably expect that. But yeah. So yeah, be concrete with it. It'll help you. And you'll get more contact information, which brings us to number two. What do we do with that contact information? You need to contact people. You need to actually do this. Um, I want to say a couple of things about this before we get into some of the questions we hear most about it. This is probably the biggest, uh, the biggest place where people fall off in their assimilation process is they don't contact people enough or they don't contact people at all. Once they have their information. I know this having led, uh, and Ben in leadership at multiple churches that having been the guy that makes the calls or makes the emails and Ben, the guy that has other people on our team would do that.
Speaker 0 00:14:45 Um, that this is something that needs to be outlined. Clearly it needs to be something that you have a very clear process of how you contact all people that give you their information and then sad to say it needs to be inspected, uh, and watched because if you, I have found this many times that if you, as you give this away to a member of your team, um, it is easy to kind of, um, pull back on the amount of contact or the specific plan that people have. And I say this as someone who's led sales teams before you and I both know we were leaders in our sales teams before, um, Ian like salespeople, uh, which is different from these people. But the sales person is someone whose job is to help someone go from someone who's looking at a company to someone who's going to make a decision to be a part of that company, or be a part of that family there at a salesperson.
Speaker 0 00:15:40 Uh, they, nobody likes getting rejected, right? And that's what happens with a lot of these contacts is that when you call someone or you text them or you email them and you get a negative response or they don't call you back or that, which is going to happen a lot with any visitor follow-up process, it's easy to take that stuff personally. It's never fun to do. And I'm going to tell you, you're not going to find someone that really likes doing this job. Uh, there might be some really weird unicorns out there that do, but they are few and far between. So I say all this is that to say that this is something that I see most often as the place where things fall down. And I often find that pastors, when they actually inspect this, they're like, you mean to tell me that we haven't been doing this system that we wrote down that it's only been doing partway or we're sending one email and then call it good, you know? So you really need to look at this. Yeah, that's
Speaker 2 00:16:36 Good. Well, that actually leads to a good transition into one of the questions you may have under this, which is w should I email call, text, send a card? What do I do? What would you say?
Speaker 0 00:16:47 Yes. All of those things, right? Yeah, absolutely. So the COO I think that obviously I think everybody should get emailed. Um, so that's probably the least invasive of all of these things here. Um, I think that a smart church, if you have an address, you'll send a physical card to, I think, a, a handwritten card. Um, it really carries a lot of weight. I see this being really great for kids that came to kids' ministry. If you have their address, having a sub, uh, one of your kids' ministry leaders send them a card, we used to do this and we put some stickers in the card too. So they stayed and got something in the mail and something to play with. It was super fun that had kids we heard over and over again, how blessed families were an excited, the kids were to receive something like that text, I would say yes, almost certainly.
Speaker 0 00:17:38 You should do that. Um, because I think text, I think five years ago, if you asked me that question, I would say, no, don't do that. That's kind of too private or invasive. I only text with people that I know, but I think that that world has changed. So a text would be appropriate. These have to be, I don't do a long, you know, 200 word text or something or, uh, a long string of texts. And I think salvation right in the text, I think a, a couple of like a Texas has, Hey, it was great having you on Sunday. Um, I hope he can make it back next week too. And we can connect a little bit more. That's a great text to send. The big question is the phone call though, right? Um, right. Well, we did leave off one that was old school that I would probably recommend against, which is the in-person visit. Uh, so, so that one, I don't know. Um, you know, I, I would probably dissuade most churches, maybe you're afraid in a really rural community or something. It might make sense. Uh, but in most urban settings I'd say probably, probably not. I decided
Speaker 2 00:18:36 To show up at some people's doors these days better have some real faith for that. So
Speaker 0 00:18:42 That's a good question. That's the big one that we end the phone call question. Um, do you have a thought, um, I thought on that, you know, again, I
Speaker 2 00:18:49 Know we're getting spam calls daily now, and I know that that is maybe looked at as the more intrusive way to do it, but I think some people still really respond. Like when we say do all of these things, different people respond to these different communication methods, you know, in different ways, in different levels. So I think it still makes sense to give a phone call it's a little more personal. You get to actually kind of insert your personality and have a kind tone and they get to hear that you genuinely want to see them again. And so I think it's a good,
Speaker 0 00:19:27 Yep. Yeah. I agree with you. Um, I, you know, I'm kind of, I think there's an age difference here where, so I think gen X-ers and boomers, they will appreciate the phone call, uh, millennials, uh, a little less than certainly gen Z. They'd probably be who on earth is calling me that I don't know. And they probably won't answer anyway, so you'll be fine. But yeah, I think that my rule of thumb is when in doubt, err, on the side of contacting more as opposed to contacting less. Uh, so I think that, well, there's the off chance that someone might feel like it's a little bit weird. They're not really going to be offended that you called and if it's a chance to make a connection, I would certainly err, on that side of making that side of making a connection with somebody there. That's good. Yeah. How often do you think we should reach out to people though? Um, how often? Yeah. How often should a, like we have all these contact methods. Should we just, I dunno you tell me I have some thoughts on this, but um, how much has he reach out?
Speaker 2 00:20:32 You don't want to barrage people constantly or every, every day or anything like that. And I think with some of these different methods, text and email, you could maybe email a little bit more than, than texting someone every day. You can, I wouldn't recommend calling someone every day or anything like that. So for sure. So I think that, I think in my mind, and I know you'll have some thoughts, you probably email and you send out a course a card once, but, but you email a little bit more text would be the next one that you do. And then phone would be probably the least that you do. How often maybe you have a better idea of that, but I think that's kind of the order.
Speaker 0 00:21:15 Yeah. If I had to say we're, we're giving them the perfect plan, right. So again, they can disagree with this. So here's the perfect plan is I'd say probably three emails in the first week. Uh, one call one text, one card. Uh, that's what I would say. So that's, that's five points of contact in the first week. So the first email probably comes Sunday afternoon. Uh, it says, Hey, it was so great to have you. Um, you know, I, I'm sorry I didn't get to meet you. Um, and I really hope we get to meet you again next week. There's probably some kind of a mid week email that says something to the effect of, uh, you know, Hey, um, here's something that's happening this week. Here's an event that's coming up and there's probably a late week email that, Hey, the sermon topic for this weekend is this.
Speaker 0 00:22:02 I hope you can come out cause that's really going to build on the last sermon. Uh, so that's the extent of that. So three emails, one call one text one, um, one, uh, one card that goes out there. Uh, so that would diminish over time. Um, you know, after, uh, I think it is okay to email them again after if they don't come back that second Sunday it's okay. And appropriate to send them an email and say, Hey, it was, uh, you know, it was really great to meet you last week. Uh, I was hoping to catch you again this week, but I guess you guys couldn't make it. That's okay too. But yeah, just wanted to see if there's any, I can be praying for you about something to that effect. That would all be really good. So again, that might seem like it's crazy to some of our audience here that seven or is that we said seven or five points of contact in the first week.
Speaker 0 00:22:50 And then after following weeks, you're going to probably wind up contacting someone seven, eight, nine times with all the emails and things that are in there that may seem crazy to people. But I will tell you that, that this is the way that you will better build connections with people and help people make that step of connecting with your church. Uh, so, and then that leads to the question of who should reach out, um, kind of take a stab at that here too. And you can chime in with any other things you think. Um, I think that at some point in the process, it's important that the lead pastor of the church is the name that's on some of this communication. Right. Uh, so that doesn't mean that you have to be actually the one doing it. I know. Um, I I'm sure at your church, your lead pastor probably has his name on stuff, but he's not the one that's typing these things out or hand writing some of these cards, I wouldn't think at a church of your size. Right. So, um, I think that having people help you with this is good, but I think some or most, or maybe even all, if you can have the communication coming from the lead pastor of the church, it really just carries more weight. What do you have to add? Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:23:54 I mean, there's been study after study and you know, most pastors are very humble and they know it's not all about them, but there's been study after study that, that, you know, 80, some odd percent of people that join a church or become a member, it's it? The number one reason was kind of the connection they felt with the pastor. I mean, they heard you preach, right. They Mo unless you had a guest speaker or somebody, they, they heard you preach, you're kind of the face of the church. And again, uh, I think that that's who you definitely opt to. So yeah, I agree.
Speaker 0 00:24:21 Yep. Yep. I think that's exactly right. So I guess that brings us to the last one is what should we ask them to do? And this is the thing, again, another call to action, another call to action. Every step here, you'll notice we have to get them to do something. So the, the next step is that we need to end this communication. You should be giving them an invitation to do something next to ask. You're reaching out, you're asking them to do something. So the first couple of contacts is probably going to be come back next Sunday. That's what the call to action is for them. But at some point you're going to actually introduce the third step, uh, in our, uh, assimilation process that we think is the perfect one here. So I'll go ahead and introduce that. So you ask them to do this, but number three is host a meet and greet a host, some kind of a place where the people that are visiting your church or new to your church can connect with leaders within your church. Um, you can call this, um, a, uh, pizza with the pastors or coffee with clergy or whatever other thing you want to call it. But, uh, having some kind of a informal casual type gathering that's primary purpose is to make a connection, put a face with the name, shake hands, share a little bit of a dialogue with people. This is the main thing. This is not a, um, a history of the church class. Uh, this is not a exhaustive, um, what we believe class, it's not a membership
Speaker 2 00:25:47 Call it membership. That's exactly what I was about to say.
Speaker 0 00:25:51 That's normal at that point. So, um, who should attend? So obviously visitors should attend this class. Uh, but I think that for most cases, this is going to be all of your church leadership, um, whether they're paid or unpaid, uh, if they're, uh, clergy or not, or if they're licensed pastors or volunteers or whatever it would be. I think anybody that would probably have an interaction with visitors, this'll be youth and children's people, anybody that will potentially be on the stage on a Sunday. So associate pastors, pastors, worship leader, uh, anybody, uh, they'd be valuable to you, uh, to help all of these people would be good for visitors and guests to meet and greet, to build relationship with. So I think these are the kinds of people that should be there. Yeah. Agreed. And
Speaker 2 00:26:36 Again, the faces, the people that they're going to most likely see up on stage, or have some sort of direct ministry contact with. So that, that totally makes sense. Yep. Yep. That's right out of that. So other than the, who it's, should we feed people? I don't know. I think I still, I think I still love a good church potluck, right? Those have been around forever. Right? You have a church pod. We've always loved food within church. And I think that even if it's someone who hasn't had a church background food seems to relax people it's always appealing. And if, especially, if you're doing this, maybe after Sunday, people are going to be hungry. They're already thinking about lunch and it, Hey, if it's a free lunch or whatever you're doing, that's great. But I think that food definitely is good. I do remember my church making probably what they would consider a mistake. One time it was just we'll have light refreshments. That's nice. But I think if you could say pizza, or you can say something to that effect sandwiches, whatever you do, that's going to definitely have, you're going to have a little bit more,
Speaker 0 00:27:47 Yeah, we probably should have said this. I think the right time to have this in the perfect process is to have it after church. If you're, if you're a Sunday worshiping church after church on Sunday, if you have other service times where visitors come, that's, you know, plan accordingly. But I think for the typical church as a 10:00 AM on Sunday service, you get out around 1130 or so, and you guys can have a meeting, then that's the right time to do it, but everybody's hungry. Uh, so you don't want people trying to ghost out of there as soon as they possibly can, uh, because they're starving. So the abs are the answer to the, should we feed people question? Absolutely. You should feed people. Uh, I would encourage, it's probably worth every penny to feed them a meal. Uh, and I there's some costs involved with that. I get that too. But I think that there is something about the connection that happens with people when they are sharing a meal together that they're actually eating that it's just better for building relationships with people. So, um, I think that that is money well spent. If you do that, it's a biblical principle to feed people. I would say probably not a potluck. You mentioned potlucks before. I know you weren't implying that we should do potlucks. Don't ask your visitors to bring them. Don't ask them
Speaker 2 00:28:55 To cook something ahead of time. No, I'm not doing that. We're not going
Speaker 0 00:28:59 To this church. So I just
Speaker 2 00:29:01 Meant the church potluck had been around, but the food's there, you might be asking, well, okay. What do you talk about at this? You already kind of touched on this it's informal, wouldn't dig deep into church history and beliefs and or if you're denominationally, affiliated, digging deep into all that stuff. I think that this is you keep it light hearted. I think you definitely talk about what you love about the church, some of the values, maybe get some people in there that could share a testimony or a story of how, you know, God impacted them at your church. You know, those types of things are really good at it's something informal and for someone who's new.
Speaker 0 00:29:41 Yep. That's exactly right. And so you don't get too deep into the theology and what it means to be a member of the church. It's not an invitation to that, but yes, I think the main thing is it's stories. This is where you tell stories, whether they are, uh, spiritual testimonies or, uh, the pastor of the church usually will share a little bit about, um, how they wound up to be the pastors, if you planted the church, you know, talk about that, but we're not getting deep into that, but it might be really like a really brief aversion. Any stories should be less than a minute or two. Um, so, uh, any testimonies, I think just really holding that in, but I would plan a few testimonies. Maybe they're staff members that have testimonies, but even better is if someone can see someone, uh, they're coming to this meet and greet, uh, and they hear from someone that is, that was in their shoes one year ago.
Speaker 0 00:30:32 And they can tell a story of, you know, we came to this and, uh, we got involved here at Trinity church. And, uh, and when we came, our marriage was a wreck, uh, and we were in a really dark place and we were talking about the D word and we were, um, really struggling. And then God came in and, and through some of the things that the marriage class that we did here at this church, we had this experience. So having that kind of a story, it really reinforces what the discipleship path that this is all about. It really reinforces that for people there. So I think that's really what, um, what would be valuable. So, and that actually, you know, since we're not talking about some of the deeper stuff that leads us to the fourth question is what should we invite them to do next, that next step in the process?
Speaker 0 00:31:16 And that is inviting them to a partnership class of some kind. So the reason why you're not talking about membership or whatever you call it, there it's because you have an additional class or maybe set of classes that get deep into the partnership or membership part of the church there. So that's the fourth item and the perfect assimilation process is post a partnership class. Um, so when should these take place, uh, these should be, uh, the meet and greets are going to be more often. Uh, so we'll have the meet and greets. You could probably host them if you're a large enough church hosting them weekly, make sense. Um, so having something where every visitor from the last week, or anybody who wants to come and you might get 10 or 20 people there, um, with this partnership type thing, you probably need a little bit more mass, um, because it's not fun to do a partnership class where you're the only person there that's becoming a member of the church and you have like 11 other people that are, that made a meal just for you.
Speaker 0 00:32:18 Yeah. Little, you might feel spoiled, but no, a little awkward. It'd be probably a little bit off putting for something like that. So yeah, these should probably these take place. They have to be at a minimum quarterly. Right? So even if you, you know, you need to have enough visitor flow that you can put these out quarterly, I think would be better if you could pull them off monthly, that would be fantastic. Um, I would not want less than probably six or seven people in a meeting like this. I wouldn't want more than 15 or 20 people in a meeting like this because you want, uh, chances for people to connect there. So, um, anyway, uh, so, uh, that's, that's kind of when they should be happening. Um, I use the term partnership. I don't know what you think about. Maybe you could add in that's what we've, I, this is kind of a church preference thing, but the membership carries some weight with it that maybe you don't want. So what do you think?
Speaker 2 00:33:06 And that term's been around for a while, you know, membership and it's kind of funny. It reminds me where we, when we, we still recommend us, but we used to more often, we don't, don't put like a members only link on your website. When we talk about website, it just makes it feel like too deep and secret society. Like, so, Hey, partnership's a good term. Um, oh, I've heard other ones before. I'm kind of drawing a blank, but, and I think a lot of it may be just depends on your people, your church culture a little bit. So I think that each church can kind of brainstorm those things. Yeah. But I, partnership class is a new, new term. I do see a lot. That's
Speaker 0 00:33:48 Fine. I know that we did both like, so I was, uh, we use the term membership, uh, at our church and then we switched to partnership and a lot more people came because it was, uh, you know, we, and we, we had a different name for it. It was called our starting point classes called it. That's what we call ours. But we called it was, uh, was, um, it was partnership is what we invited people to. Uh, so when they, the point of the class was to invite them, you know, kind of the next step is to become a partner with our church. And I'm not a member of our church because membership felt more passive. I feel like that partnership and it feels more like I'm a part of it. Uh, and so, uh, we found that we got some good results from that. So, but what are some of the things that need to get communicated in that class? What do we talk about in this one? Would you say, and what do people need to know? This is where you can go a little
Speaker 2 00:34:39 Bit deeper. I mean, cause I think they're at this point where they're for lack of a better word bought in on your church a little bit. And I think that, you know, this is where your beliefs in kind of where you can talk about different opportunities of service, where they can put their gifts, you know, talk a little bit about helping them find their spiritual gifts. Talk a little bit about small groups, small groups. Of course, that's always a good way to get someone deeper connected. We know all, everyone knows that. So this is where you can go a little bit deeper with those things that we said that you don't want to do at the meeting.
Speaker 0 00:35:13 Right? Yeah. I think this is a spot where, what we like to do at these a partnership or our starting point classes. I find that it's great to bring up some of those tricky theological questions and be able to give them, uh, the, the information in the right kind of a setting and paint the right picture. So for instance, like we were a church, we were a part of a Foursquare denomination. So we were a Foursquare church. Uh, the background is we ordained women and we are on the spirit filled side of the charismatic, uh, versus, uh, I guess a more traditional conservative type of spectrum there. And so we would, we would talk a little bit there about how we don't hate churches, that, uh, don't ordain women, but at our church, we will have women that share the message at times, and this is why we do it.
Speaker 0 00:36:02 And here's some scriptures that back that up, but we talk about those things and you know, we're also a spirit filled church. That's why you'll see some people raising their hands and in times of worship, and this is why we do that. And so it led us kind of answer some of those objections that people might already be concerned about and kind of paint those things in a good light there. So it was good for us to do those kinds of things. Uh, but I think the main crux of this, these, uh, this partnership class, uh, is to number one, kind of, uh, help people become a partner with your church, but you really need to define what that means. What does a fully committed member of a church look like? And the right answer to that is going to vary a little bit from church to church, but in general, it's these few things it's, they're involved in.
Speaker 0 00:36:46 Some, they come on Sundays, they're involved in some kind of a outside of Sunday discipleship. So usually that's a small groups or maybe for your church at Sunday school or a, or a Wednesday night service or something. But usually it's some kind of a small discipleship group. They have a place of service. So they have someplace that they're giving back and then they're giving. Those are usually the four things that most churches are, are asking people to do to become a partner. And you need to spell that out for people and help people see that this is what is expected. This is what our partners do. If you want to be a part of this movement that we have here, this is what that would look like. And this is what we're going to ask you to do. Uh, and, um, you know, again, it's another place that I think a lot of times the call to action thing, that's the thing that scares people a little bit to do it because there's a chance of rejection, right? When you, when you ask someone, will you give there's a chance that they could say no. Or if you say, would you serve? They could say no to something like that. And nobody likes being told no. And so sometimes this is where we fall down on things, but have the courage to know that that's what you should be doing and asking people to respond. What do you have to add in, well, here's the thing they're
Speaker 2 00:37:55 Going to end up here in that eventually. Anyway, if those are things that, you know, a partner or a member of your church are doing, it's going to come out in a message. It's going to come from someone else. So if you're doing it upfront, I think that's a good thing. You know, the expectations, if you will have been laid out, I think most people appreciate that hearing that instead of being surprised later by something. So I think that that may be, can put some pastors at ease or encourage them. We know it takes a little bit of boldness, but, and do it tactfully, not forcefully, but I think identifying that upfront, it's going to, it's going to bring you healthy. It's gonna bring you the people that you want at your church too. Right? So I think that's the takeaway there as
Speaker 0 00:38:36 Well. One of the, one of the things that's freeing, I find, uh, and, and we see this in the way Jesus, uh, even presented his message is that he would, he talked about how the cost was great, right? So he was very upfront. He didn't sugar coat it and say, you get all these great things and it doesn't cost you anything. The way that he delivered the gospel is that, you know, it told people to count the cost. Before you say, you're going to do this, like really look at what it's going to cost you. I think I found in, in really any kind of, uh, convincing or persuasion that I've done in my life. So we do this in our business all the time. And I've done this as a pastor. Um, we, we give persuasive messages, any kind of persuasion, making sure that you don't just pretend there's no cost to this.
Speaker 0 00:39:21 Don't just minimize that and say, um, you know, that's, it's going to be super easy and don't pretend that it's somehow like that. There's only one right answer to this. Either. There may be people that aren't ready to be partners with you just yet. And you need to give them permission to say, to, to pray about it, more, to think about it, to try to do whatever they need to do, but giving people the opportunity doesn't mean forcing them or cornering them into the opportunity. I wouldn't say something like, Hey, in this partnership class, I usually would say, Hey, this may not be for everybody here yet. And if you're not there yet, that is totally okay. Uh, I hope we, I love this church. So I hope you do get there cause I really, we want more partners and we want you to be a part of it.
Speaker 0 00:40:03 But if that's not you yet, I am. I affirmed that. And that's totally okay to be there. But if you are there and you want to be a partner with us, I want to invite you to do that. To make that commitment formal, we would have someone kind of sign up on a form there when they would do that. If they wanted to partner with us. Uh, and we just felt that was a good culture, but don't feel like you need to corner people in this, give them the opportunity to do whatever they feel called to do. We're not here to manipulate or compel people. We want to encourage them towards a relationship with Jesus. That's good. That's good. Yeah, that's good. So that's the process, that's it? Four simple steps. You need to follow up with them after that and help them get into places of service and small groups and those things.
Speaker 0 00:40:43 We assume that you have systems in place for that already. But, um, this is what we would encourage every single church to, to build something like or close to something like this here. Um, I know that it, it seems like a daunting task, but really it's not that much that we've added here. Sure. There's time to create curriculum for a partnership class. If you don't have one, I imagine most churches have something already in that realm. They're, uh, you know, writing these emails and the communication and formalizing that system of contact, all that stuff. It shouldn't take you months and months to do it. Something that if you put your head down and worked on it for a day, you could get this, these kinds of things implemented. I know churches move slowly. And that's how that goes sometimes. But I just want to encourage you that visitors are a gift from God.
Speaker 0 00:41:29 Uh, and, uh, I, I, it breaks my heart to see it when we are, when we squander our gifts from God, every time someone gives you their contact info, they come into your building. If we're not using that to its full potential, we are, we're squandering the gifts that God has given us. He has lots to say about that and the parable of the talents and what he does with those that are responsible with his gifts. And so, and what he does with those that aren't responsible with it. We won't go there right now, but, uh, it's something that I think take it seriously. I hope this has been an encouragement to you. Um, folks, if it has been an encouragement to you, I just want to thank you guys for being part of our reach, right family, uh, you guys tuning in every week.
Speaker 0 00:42:10 It means a lot to us. Uh, if that is something that you do, please rate, review, subscribe, um, you can subscribe and hit the notifications button so that you'll get notified every Friday. If you're watching on YouTube or Facebook or every Thursday, if you're doing this, uh, on the audio format here. Uh, so we just want to thank you guys so much for being a part of our retried family for kind of partnering with us and all of this. It means the world to us. And we just want to thank you. So until next week we'll catch you, then <inaudible>
Speaker 1 00:42:41 Thanks for listening to the reach right podcast. We hope this episode will help you reach people the right way, looking for more resources for your church. Check us out online at reach, right studios.com. If this episode has been helpful to you, it would mean the world to us. If you would rate, review and subscribe on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks again for listening. And we'll see you next week. <inaudible>.
